{"id":167258,"date":"2015-03-17T15:24:10","date_gmt":"2015-03-17T19:24:10","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/webadmin.news-harvard.go-vip.net\/gazette\/gazette\/?p=167258"},"modified":"2019-03-08T17:40:32","modified_gmt":"2019-03-08T22:40:32","slug":"a-siren-call-of-action","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2015\/03\/a-siren-call-of-action\/","title":{"rendered":"A siren call to action"},"content":{"rendered":"\n\t
\"\"

A British trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the latest among a growing number of teenagers and young adults from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, Canada, and various European nations who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. <\/p>

Credit: Metropolitan Police\/London<\/p><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\t

\n\t\t\t\n\t\t\tNation & World\t\t<\/a>\n\t\t\n\t\t

\n\t\tA siren call to action\t<\/h1>\n\n\t\n\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\n\t
\n\t\t
\n\t\t\t
\n\t\t\t\t\t

\n\t\tChristina Pazzanese\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t

\n\t\t\tHarvard Staff Writer\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/address>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\n\t\t

\n\t\t\tHow and why the Islamic State is finding avid converts among the West\u2019s middle class\t\t<\/h2>\n\t\t\n<\/header>\n\n\n\n
\n\n\n\t\t

Family and friends describe them not as radicals, but as well-behaved and diligent students at a London private high school. So it came as a shock when the three British girls slipped their passports into handbags, casually walked out of their homes, and boarded a flight to Istanbul to join the Islamic State, or ISIS, in Syria last month. <\/em><\/p>\n

British authorities believe that the teenagers, who disappeared last month, were likely aided by Aqsa Mahmood<\/a>, a young woman originally from Scotland who helps recruit for the extremist group.<\/em><\/p>\n

The trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the latest<\/a> among a growing<\/a> number<\/a> of teenagers and young adults<\/a> from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, Canada<\/a>, and various European nations<\/a> who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. In late February, the Washington Post<\/a> identified \u201cJihadi John,\u201d the masked man seen in several ISIS videos beheading hostages, as a college-educated computer programmer from a well-off family in West London. Although a precise figure isn\u2019t known, Lt. Gen. James Clapper, director of U.S. national intelligence, told Congress last month that an estimated 3,400 citizens from Western countries have traveled to Iraq and Syria, presumably to join ISIS. <\/em><\/p>\n

Jessica E. Stern<\/a>, Ph.D. \u201992, is a fellow at the FXB Center for Health and Human Rights<\/a> at the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health<\/a> (HSPH) and a lecturer in the Government Department<\/a> at Harvard\u2019s Faculty of Arts and Sciences<\/a> (FAS). She serves on the Hoover Institution Task Force on National Security and Law and was a member of the National Security Council staff during the Clinton administration. Stern has written extensively<\/a> about terrorism and violent extremists. Her latest book<\/a>, \u201cISIS: The State of Terror,\u201d co-authored with J.M. Berger<\/a>, will be released March 24. Stern spoke with the Gazette about how and why ISIS has been increasingly effective in luring young Westerners to its side.<\/em>
\n<\/strong><\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> We know that the so-called Islamic State is extraordinarily media-savvy. What social-media platforms have been most effective in reaching Western recruits?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> There\u2019s been a lot of activity on Twitter. Aqsa Mahmood is a good example. She\u2019s been accused of enticing the three young women from London who apparently left their homes to join the Islamic State. She\u2019s also known as Umm Layth, which means \u201cmother of the lion.\u201d She spoke to them on Twitter, and then they ended up moving to an encrypted platform to continue their discussion, which is a common recruitment tactic. [Mahmood] also answers questions on Ask.fm. Somehow her postings are attracting young women, some of them very high-achieving, to leave home to join the jihad.<\/p>\n

There\u2019s a big debate about what should be taken off Twitter and whether Twitter is inadvertently facilitating terrorist recruitment. Twitter\u2019s automated list of \u201cwho to follow\u201d makes it easy for a person interested in ISIS to rapidly find additional ISIS supporters. Sometimes, ISIS accounts are suspended, but often, shortly afterward, a new account with a new name appears, which serious followers can find.<\/p>\n

There\u2019s a debate among those who think we should allow those accounts to remain active, and those who think that Twitter should be suspending terrorist accounts. Those who say that the accounts should be left alone argue that they\u2019re a good way to gather intelligence, and that removing them would only result in recruiters moving to a less-transparent platform. Those who want the accounts shut down say that private companies should not allow ISIS and other groups to use social media to recruit followers, and that terrorists\u2019 use of social media to promote violence does not constitute protected speech. Twitter recently suspended over 2,000 ISIS-related accounts. ISIS has now declared war against Twitter, threatening the lives of its staff.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the pitch to male and female potential recruits?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> For the men, it\u2019s, \u201cCome and fight if you can fight; if you can\u2019t fight we also need doctors, we need social-media experts, engineers \u2026 We\u2019re running a state, and so if you feel you can\u2019t handle fighting, we can still use you.\u201d The women are often recruited to marry jihadists: \u201cYou can participate in the jihad by marrying. You can be the mother of the next generation.\u201d It is a fairly traditional female role.<\/p>\n

There are tremendous social benefits for recruits: You\u2019re making a world a better place, or so the group claims, which provides a kind of spiritual reward. There\u2019s financial reward for the fighters. ISIS actually pays the fighters, gives them free housing, offers to provide them wives. Hence, the need to recruit young women. There\u2019s also the tremendous lure of extreme fundamentalism. I think we can all understand the appeal: Wouldn\u2019t it be nice to have easy answers to every morally complex question? Inside a group like ISIS, life becomes morally simple. The rules are clear. Good and evil come out in stark relief.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> What\u2019s the psychological profile of those people most susceptible to their message?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> We don\u2019t have a profile of the Westerners joining ISIS yet because there haven\u2019t been large studies. But I can tell you that [British intelligence agency] MI5 did a study of Westerners who were involved in or closely associated with extremist activity, prior to ISIS\u2019s recent recruitment drive. They found that a surprisingly high number of them were converts to Islam. Many in the MI5 study were relatively ignorant of Islam, even if they were Muslim. Umm Layth is a good example. She grew up in a secular Muslim family and went from relative ignorance about Islam to recruiting for ISIS.<\/p>\n

An important factor seems to be the desire to forge a new identity, an identity with dignity. I interviewed terrorists for many years and I can tell you that identity is often absolutely key. We also know that there is a higher rate of mental illness among so-called lone wolves, people who are inspired (often online) to commit terrorist actions without physically joining an extremist group. Studies of Westerners joining jihadi organizations, prior to ISIS\u2019s recruitment drive, have shown that foreign fighters tend to be alienated or marginalized within their own societies; they may have had a bad encounter with police or distrust local authorities. They tend to disapprove of their nation\u2019s foreign policies. If they\u2019re living in an ethnic enclave, they\u2019re likely to be alienated from people living alongside them, as well as the country as a whole, whether it\u2019s the United States, or the U.K. or elsewhere in the West. For those who join ISIS, I think that there\u2019s got to be an element of thrill-seeking as well, perhaps even an attraction to violence. It\u2019s hard for me to imagine that anybody who gets recruited today doesn\u2019t know about ISIS\u2019s extreme brutality.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> Is the impulse to join the Islamic State very different from, say, the idealistic impulse of young people to join the Peace Corps or a nongovernmental organization, or any global organization they believe is doing important and uplifting work?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> Many of the people who join terrorist organizations believe they are making the world a better place. They see pictures of [Syrian leader Bashar] Assad\u2019s brutality against his own people, and they feel the desire to help. That sense of righteousness is a very appealing aspect of joining a terrorist group, for some. But I would say in some ways it\u2019s more like joining the Weather Underground than the Peace Corps. At this point, it\u2019s hard to imagine anyone joining without knowing that they\u2019re going to be involved in real atrocities.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> But in their minds, those actions are righteous.<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> Absolutely.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> How effective is Mahmood as a recruiter, and what makes these Western recruiters so successful? Do they tend to be true believers or mere cynical mercenaries?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> She is very effective. My guess is that it\u2019s partly because she knows how to relate to young women like herself. She knows their lives. ISIS is using Westerners to run the social media campaign to recruit Westerners.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> The State Department has recently announced that it has stepped up its counter-messaging efforts. What are they doing, and is that likely to be sufficient, given the sophisticated and prolific nature of the Islamic State?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> They have a program called \u201cThink Again Turn Away,\u201d and if you look at what they\u2019ve been doing and compare it with what ISIS has been doing, it\u2019s so boring. ISIS has professional cameramen. \u2026<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> The ISIS production values are quite high. It\u2019s not like the old al-Qaida training videos we used to see.<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> No, it\u2019s not. If you look at what the State Department puts out, sadly, you can tell that they didn\u2019t have a lot of money. But the guy who ran that program told me, \u201cLook, I know we can\u2019t compete with the video imagery showing, \u2018Here\u2019s your chance to create this very pure state, and you\u2019re going to get to kill infidels and Shiites.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> They can\u2019t compete on the messaging or on the production values?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> Both. ISIS has made an enemy of the entire world, other than those who join it. I hope that we\u2019re going to get much more serious \u2014 we outside the government \u2014 to find ways to respond. There is a program that I\u2019d like to bring to Harvard. I\u2019ve been advocating for years to have young people design counter-messaging programs, rather than State Department employees or Madison Avenue. There is an organization, EdVenture Partners, that created a curriculum for students around the world to compete to create the most effective counter-messaging. The students will create digital platforms to amplify the messages of clerics who can argue against ISIS\u2019 interpretation of Islam, or of former members of ISIS who turned against the organization. Those are just two examples; there are all kinds of things that can be done. The initiative is called \u201cP2P: Challenging Extremism.\u201d I would love to get students from across the University, students in engineering, students in political science, students who speak languages, or who are very good at communications \u2026 ideally we want a completely interdisciplinary group. I\u2019m just so excited about this.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> Besides better coordinating the State Department\u2019s fragmented messaging efforts, I wonder if that\u2019s ever going to be sufficient compared to the prolific nature of ISIS. I understand they\u2019re sending out<\/a> as many as 200,000 social media messages per day.<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> No. It\u2019s never going to be enough. I think the private sector has to get involved. I\u2019m hoping Harvard alumni will be inspired to get involved.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the Islamic State\u2019s end game? Is it to provoke global Armageddon, or does it want to control the world and have everyone live under its terms?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> They want to establish a worldwide caliphate. The dream is to take over the world. They are also obsessed with the Apocalypse. Although ISIS claims to justify its actions by referring to religious texts, ordinary Muslims have no idea what ISIS is talking about. The Quran is not an apocalyptic book, so ISIS has to borrow from different apocalyptic narratives. Their online English language magazine, it\u2019s called Dabiq, which is the name of the town where ISIS believes the final battle of the Apocalypse will take place.<\/p>\n

They believe that sexually enslaving women who are from religious minorities is a good thing; it\u2019s a sign that the End Times are coming. They also justify sexual slavery as a way of avoiding the sin of adultery or premarital sex, because if you have sex with a slave, it\u2019s not really sex, or so they claim. They can be pedophiles.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> Why is religion such a useful framework or pretext for terrorism, subjugation, and genocide?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> ISIS is a millenarian movement. They want to create a new human being the same way the Soviets wanted to create a new human being. They want to recreate humanity, and they want to create a purified world. It\u2019s a cosmic battle to them. It\u2019s not totally different from communism or other ideologies, but God is a pretty compelling citation.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> Does religion give it a patina of righteousness or defuse any accusations that this is a mere power grab?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> I think religion is often a patina or marketing strategy for terrorists to accomplish more worldly goals. In the case of ISIS, many of the leaders are former Baathists, the secular political party that ruled Iraq prior to the 2003 invasion. [Abu Bakr al-] Baghdadi, the \u201ccaliph\u201d of the Islamic State, recruited former military and intelligence personnel from Saddam Hussein\u2019s Iraq. They have important, useful skills. ISIS\u2019s religious agenda is clearly intermingled with its more secular goals. ISIS is capitalizing on the feeling among Sunni Muslims that they are under threat in the new Iraq, and that ISIS is the only protection they have from the Iraqi leadership\u2019s anti-Sunni, sectarian policies.<\/p>\n

GAZETTE:<\/strong> In human history, where does ISIS rank in terms of what they\u2019ve been able to accomplish \u2014 their lethality and their organizational strength \u2014 in such a brief amount of time?<\/p>\n

STERN:<\/strong> Compared with modern terrorist organizations that we know, they rank very high. However, compared with the Khmer Rouge, the Nazis, the communists, they rank pretty low both in terms of their accomplishments and even in terms of their brutality. We\u2019ve seen much worse. ISIS is not just a terrorist group; it is also an insurgent army. While it\u2019s shocking to see how much territory ISIS acquired so quickly, we\u2019re comparing it with terrorist groups that weren\u2019t necessarily trying to acquire large amounts of territory. The ideology, the brutality of this group \u2014 I have to think they\u2019re going to self-destruct before they manage to spread as far as, say, the communists or the Nazis. The Nazis weren\u2019t advertising their atrocities; ISIS is publicizing its atrocities, flaunting its brutality. It\u2019s part of the End Times narrative that ISIS hopes to spin.<\/p>\n

This article has been lightly edited for length and clarity.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n<\/div>\n\n\t\t","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Professor Jessica E. 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Stern, a leading terrorism expert, talks about the growing number of young, middle-class Westerners leaving home to join the Islamic State.","inLanguage":"en-US","potentialAction":[{"@type":"ReadAction","target":["https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2015\/03\/a-siren-call-of-action\/"]}]},{"@type":"ImageObject","inLanguage":"en-US","@id":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2015\/03\/a-siren-call-of-action\/#primaryimage","url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/03\/isis_3teens_605.jpg","contentUrl":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/03\/isis_3teens_605.jpg","width":605,"height":403},{"@type":"WebSite","@id":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/#website","url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/","name":"Harvard Gazette","description":"Official news from Harvard University covering innovation in teaching, learning, and 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school of public health\",\"isis\",\"islamic state\",\"j.m. berger\",\"jessica e. stern\",\"terrorism\"],\"dateCreated\":\"2015-03-17T19:24:10Z\",\"datePublished\":\"2015-03-17T19:24:10Z\",\"dateModified\":\"2019-03-08T22:40:32Z\"}<\/script>","tracker_url":"https:\/\/cdn.parsely.com\/keys\/news.harvard.edu\/p.js"},"jetpack_featured_media_url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/03\/isis_3teens_605.jpg","has_blocks":true,"block_data":{"0":{"blockName":"harvard-gazette\/article-header","attrs":{"blockColorPalette":"","coloredHeading":"","creditText":"Credit: Metropolitan Police\/London","displayDetails":"","displayTitle":"","categoryId":1378,"mediaAlt":"","mediaCaption":"A British trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the latest among a growing number of teenagers and young adults from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, Canada, and various European nations who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. ","mediaId":167260,"mediaSize":"full","mediaType":"image","mediaUrl":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/03\/isis_3teens_605.jpg","poster":"","title":"A siren call to action","subheading":"How and why the Islamic State is finding avid converts among the West\u2019s middle class","centeredImage":true,"className":"is-style-full-width-text-below","mediaHeight":403,"mediaWidth":605,"backgroundFixed":false,"backgroundTone":"light","coloredBackground":false,"displayOverlay":true,"fadeInText":false,"isAmbient":false,"mediaLength":"","mediaPosition":"","posterText":"","titleAbove":false,"useUncroppedImage":false,"lock":[],"metadata":[]},"innerBlocks":[],"innerHTML":"<figure class=\"wp-block-image\"><img alt=\"\" height=\"403\" loading=\"eager\" src=\"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/03\/isis_3teens_605.jpg\" width=\"605\"\/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\"><p class=\"wp-element-caption--caption\">A British trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the latest among a growing number of teenagers and young adults from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, Canada, and various European nations who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. <\/p><p class=\"wp-element-caption--credit\">Credit: Metropolitan Police\/London<\/p><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n","innerContent":["<figure class=\"wp-block-image\"><img alt=\"\" height=\"403\" loading=\"eager\" src=\"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/03\/isis_3teens_605.jpg\" width=\"605\"\/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\"><p class=\"wp-element-caption--caption\">A British trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the latest among a growing number of teenagers and young adults from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, Canada, and various European nations who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. <\/p><p class=\"wp-element-caption--credit\">Credit: Metropolitan Police\/London<\/p><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n"],"rendered":"<header\n\tclass=\"wp-block-harvard-gazette-article-header alignfull article-header is-style-full-width-text-below centered-image\"\n\tstyle=\" \"\n>\n\t<figure class=\"wp-block-image\"><img alt=\"\" height=\"403\" loading=\"eager\" src=\"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/03\/isis_3teens_605.jpg\" width=\"605\"\/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\"><p class=\"wp-element-caption--caption\">A British trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the latest among a growing number of teenagers and young adults from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, Canada, and various European nations who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. <\/p><p class=\"wp-element-caption--credit\">Credit: Metropolitan Police\/London<\/p><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\t<div class=\"article-header__content\">\n\t\t\t<a\n\t\t\tclass=\"article-header__category\"\n\t\t\thref=\"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/section\/nation-world\/\"\n\t\t>\n\t\t\tNation & World\t\t<\/a>\n\t\t\n\t\t<h1 class=\"article-header__title wp-block-heading \">\n\t\tA siren call to action\t<\/h1>\n\n\t\n\t\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t\n\t<div class=\"article-header__meta\">\n\t\t<div class=\"wp-block-post-author\">\n\t\t\t<address class=\"wp-block-post-author__content\">\n\t\t\t\t\t<p class=\"author wp-block-post-author__name\">\n\t\tChristina Pazzanese\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t<p class=\"wp-block-post-author__byline\">\n\t\t\tHarvard Staff Writer\t\t<\/p>\n\t\t\t\t\t<\/address>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\n\t\t<time class=\"article-header__date\" datetime=\"2015-03-17\">\n\t\t\tMarch 17, 2015\t\t<\/time>\n\n\t\t<span class=\"article-header__reading-time\">\n\t\t\tlong read\t\t<\/span>\n\t<\/div>\n\n\t\n\t\t\t<h2 class=\"article-header__subheading wp-block-heading\">\n\t\t\tHow and why the Islamic State is finding avid converts among the West\u2019s middle class\t\t<\/h2>\n\t\t\n<\/header>\n"},"2":{"blockName":"core\/group","attrs":{"templateLock":false,"metadata":{"name":"Article content"},"align":"wide","layout":{"type":"constrained","justifyContent":"center"},"tagName":"div","lock":[],"className":"","style":[],"backgroundColor":"","textColor":"","gradient":"","fontSize":"","fontFamily":"","borderColor":"","ariaLabel":"","anchor":""},"innerBlocks":[{"blockName":"core\/freeform","attrs":{"content":"","lock":[],"metadata":[]},"innerBlocks":[],"innerHTML":"\n\t\t<p><em>Family and friends describe them not as radicals, but as well-behaved and diligent students at a London private high school. So it came as a shock when the three British girls slipped their passports into handbags, casually walked out of their homes, and boarded a flight to Istanbul to join the Islamic State, or ISIS, in Syria last month. <\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>British authorities believe that the teenagers, who disappeared last month, were likely aided by <a href=\"http:\/\/www.theguardian.com\/world\/2014\/sep\/06\/scottish-woman-married-isis-fighter-martyr-aqsa-mahmood\">Aqsa Mahmood<\/a>, a young woman originally from Scotland who helps recruit for the extremist group.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>The trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.wnyc.org\/story\/new-york-city-produces-its-first-homegrown-isis-recruits\/\">latest<\/a> among a <a href=\"http:\/\/www.usatoday.com\/story\/news\/nation\/2014\/10\/06\/isis-arrested-terrorism-us-teenager-chicago-ohare\/16810803\/\">growing<\/a> <a href=\"http:\/\/www.cnn.com\/2014\/09\/10\/justice\/colorado-jihadist-guilty-plea\/index.html\">number<\/a> of teenagers and <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/local\/crime\/northern-va-teen-thought-to-have-helped-man-join-islamic-state\/2015\/03\/04\/51c7ec34-c1e6-11e4-ad5c-3b8ce89f1b89_story.html\">young adults<\/a> from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, <a href=\"http:\/\/rt.com\/news\/228415-isis-canadian-female-tweets\/\">Canada<\/a>, and various <a href=\"http:\/\/www.independent.co.uk\/news\/world\/europe\/belgian-isis-fighter-taunts-authorities-saying-he-slipped-out-of-country-like-knife-through-butter-9983534.html\">European nations<\/a> who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. In late February, the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/world\/national-security\/jihadi-john-the-islamic-state-killer-behind-the-mask-is-a-young-londoner\/2015\/02\/25\/d6dbab16-bc43-11e4-bdfa-b8e8f594e6ee_story.html\">Washington Post<\/a> identified \u201cJihadi John,\u201d the masked man seen in several ISIS videos beheading hostages, as a college-educated computer programmer from a well-off family in West London. Although a precise figure isn\u2019t known, Lt. Gen. James Clapper, director of U.S. national intelligence, told Congress last month that an estimated 3,400 citizens from Western countries have traveled to Iraq and Syria, presumably to join ISIS. <\/em><\/p>\n<p><em><a href=\"http:\/\/jessicasternbooks.com\/about\/\">Jessica E. Stern<\/a>, Ph.D. \u201992, is a fellow at the <a href=\"http:\/\/fxb.harvard.edu\">FXB Center for Health and Human Rights<\/a> at the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.hsph.harvard.edu\/\">Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health<\/a> (HSPH) and a lecturer in the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.gov.harvard.edu\/\">Government Department<\/a> at Harvard\u2019s <a href=\"http:\/\/www.fas.harvard.edu\/\">Faculty of Arts and Sciences<\/a> (FAS). She serves on the Hoover Institution Task Force on National Security and Law and was a member of the National Security Council staff during the Clinton administration. Stern has <a href=\"http:\/\/jessicasternbooks.com\/books\/terror-in-the-name-of-god\/\">written extensively<\/a> about terrorism and violent extremists. Her <a href=\"http:\/\/www.press.org\/events\/book-rap-jessica-stern-jm-berger-isis-state-terror\">latest book<\/a>, \u201cISIS: The State of Terror,\u201d co-authored with <a href=\"http:\/\/www.brookings.edu\/experts\/bergerjm\">J.M. Berger<\/a>, will be released March 24. Stern spoke with the Gazette about how and why ISIS has been increasingly effective in luring young Westerners to its side.<\/em><strong><br \/>\n<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> We know that the so-called Islamic State is extraordinarily media-savvy. What social-media platforms have been most effective in reaching Western recruits?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> There\u2019s been a lot of activity on Twitter. Aqsa Mahmood is a good example. She\u2019s been accused of enticing the three young women from London who apparently left their homes to join the Islamic State. She\u2019s also known as Umm Layth, which means \u201cmother of the lion.\u201d She spoke to them on Twitter, and then they ended up moving to an encrypted platform to continue their discussion, which is a common recruitment tactic. [Mahmood] also answers questions on Ask.fm. Somehow her postings are attracting young women, some of them very high-achieving, to leave home to join the jihad.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s a big debate about what should be taken off Twitter and whether Twitter is inadvertently facilitating terrorist recruitment. Twitter\u2019s automated list of \u201cwho to follow\u201d makes it easy for a person interested in ISIS to rapidly find additional ISIS supporters. Sometimes, ISIS accounts are suspended, but often, shortly afterward, a new account with a new name appears, which serious followers can find.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s a debate among those who think we should allow those accounts to remain active, and those who think that Twitter should be suspending terrorist accounts. Those who say that the accounts should be left alone argue that they\u2019re a good way to gather intelligence, and that removing them would only result in recruiters moving to a less-transparent platform. Those who want the accounts shut down say that private companies should not allow ISIS and other groups to use social media to recruit followers, and that terrorists\u2019 use of social media to promote violence does not constitute protected speech. Twitter recently suspended over 2,000 ISIS-related accounts. ISIS has now declared war against Twitter, threatening the lives of its staff.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the pitch to male and female potential recruits?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> For the men, it\u2019s, \u201cCome and fight if you can fight; if you can\u2019t fight we also need doctors, we need social-media experts, engineers \u2026 We\u2019re running a state, and so if you feel you can\u2019t handle fighting, we can still use you.\u201d The women are often recruited to marry jihadists: \u201cYou can participate in the jihad by marrying. You can be the mother of the next generation.\u201d It is a fairly traditional female role.<\/p>\n<p>There are tremendous social benefits for recruits: You\u2019re making a world a better place, or so the group claims, which provides a kind of spiritual reward. There\u2019s financial reward for the fighters. ISIS actually pays the fighters, gives them free housing, offers to provide them wives. Hence, the need to recruit young women. There\u2019s also the tremendous lure of extreme fundamentalism. I think we can all understand the appeal: Wouldn\u2019t it be nice to have easy answers to every morally complex question? Inside a group like ISIS, life becomes morally simple. The rules are clear. Good and evil come out in stark relief.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What\u2019s the psychological profile of those people most susceptible to their message?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> We don\u2019t have a profile of the Westerners joining ISIS yet because there haven\u2019t been large studies. But I can tell you that [British intelligence agency] MI5 did a study of Westerners who were involved in or closely associated with extremist activity, prior to ISIS\u2019s recent recruitment drive. They found that a surprisingly high number of them were converts to Islam. Many in the MI5 study were relatively ignorant of Islam, even if they were Muslim. Umm Layth is a good example. She grew up in a secular Muslim family and went from relative ignorance about Islam to recruiting for ISIS.<\/p>\n<p>An important factor seems to be the desire to forge a new identity, an identity with dignity. I interviewed terrorists for many years and I can tell you that identity is often absolutely key. We also know that there is a higher rate of mental illness among so-called lone wolves, people who are inspired (often online) to commit terrorist actions without physically joining an extremist group. Studies of Westerners joining jihadi organizations, prior to ISIS\u2019s recruitment drive, have shown that foreign fighters tend to be alienated or marginalized within their own societies; they may have had a bad encounter with police or distrust local authorities. They tend to disapprove of their nation\u2019s foreign policies. If they\u2019re living in an ethnic enclave, they\u2019re likely to be alienated from people living alongside them, as well as the country as a whole, whether it\u2019s the United States, or the U.K. or elsewhere in the West. For those who join ISIS, I think that there\u2019s got to be an element of thrill-seeking as well, perhaps even an attraction to violence. It\u2019s hard for me to imagine that anybody who gets recruited today doesn\u2019t know about ISIS\u2019s extreme brutality.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Is the impulse to join the Islamic State very different from, say, the idealistic impulse of young people to join the Peace Corps or a nongovernmental organization, or any global organization they believe is doing important and uplifting work?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Many of the people who join terrorist organizations believe they are making the world a better place. They see pictures of [Syrian leader Bashar] Assad\u2019s brutality against his own people, and they feel the desire to help. That sense of righteousness is a very appealing aspect of joining a terrorist group, for some. But I would say in some ways it\u2019s more like joining the Weather Underground than the Peace Corps. At this point, it\u2019s hard to imagine anyone joining without knowing that they\u2019re going to be involved in real atrocities.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> But in their minds, those actions are righteous.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Absolutely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> How effective is Mahmood as a recruiter, and what makes these Western recruiters so successful? Do they tend to be true believers or mere cynical mercenaries?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> She is very effective. My guess is that it\u2019s partly because she knows how to relate to young women like herself. She knows their lives. ISIS is using Westerners to run the social media campaign to recruit Westerners.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> The State Department has recently announced that it has stepped up its counter-messaging efforts. What are they doing, and is that likely to be sufficient, given the sophisticated and prolific nature of the Islamic State?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> They have a program called \u201cThink Again Turn Away,\u201d and if you look at what they\u2019ve been doing and compare it with what ISIS has been doing, it\u2019s so boring. ISIS has professional cameramen. \u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> The ISIS production values are quite high. It\u2019s not like the old al-Qaida training videos we used to see.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> No, it\u2019s not. If you look at what the State Department puts out, sadly, you can tell that they didn\u2019t have a lot of money. But the guy who ran that program told me, \u201cLook, I know we can\u2019t compete with the video imagery showing, \u2018Here\u2019s your chance to create this very pure state, and you\u2019re going to get to kill infidels and Shiites.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> They can\u2019t compete on the messaging or on the production values?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Both. ISIS has made an enemy of the entire world, other than those who join it. I hope that we\u2019re going to get much more serious \u2014 we outside the government \u2014 to find ways to respond. There is a program that I\u2019d like to bring to Harvard. I\u2019ve been advocating for years to have young people design counter-messaging programs, rather than State Department employees or Madison Avenue. There is an organization, EdVenture Partners, that created a curriculum for students around the world to compete to create the most effective counter-messaging. The students will create digital platforms to amplify the messages of clerics who can argue against ISIS\u2019 interpretation of Islam, or of former members of ISIS who turned against the organization. Those are just two examples; there are all kinds of things that can be done. The initiative is called \u201cP2P: Challenging Extremism.\u201d I would love to get students from across the University, students in engineering, students in political science, students who speak languages, or who are very good at communications \u2026 ideally we want a completely interdisciplinary group. I\u2019m just so excited about this.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Besides better coordinating the State Department\u2019s fragmented messaging efforts, I wonder if that\u2019s ever going to be sufficient compared to the prolific nature of ISIS. I understand they\u2019re <a href=\"http:\/\/www.politifact.com\/punditfact\/statements\/2015\/feb\/19\/hillary-mann-leverett\/cnn-expert-islamic-state-posts-90000-social-media-\/\">sending out<\/a> as many as 200,000 social media messages per day.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> No. It\u2019s never going to be enough. I think the private sector has to get involved. I\u2019m hoping Harvard alumni will be inspired to get involved.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the Islamic State\u2019s end game? Is it to provoke global Armageddon, or does it want to control the world and have everyone live under its terms?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> They want to establish a worldwide caliphate. The dream is to take over the world. They are also obsessed with the Apocalypse. Although ISIS claims to justify its actions by referring to religious texts, ordinary Muslims have no idea what ISIS is talking about. The Quran is not an apocalyptic book, so ISIS has to borrow from different apocalyptic narratives. Their online English language magazine, it\u2019s called Dabiq, which is the name of the town where ISIS believes the final battle of the Apocalypse will take place.<\/p>\n<p>They believe that sexually enslaving women who are from religious minorities is a good thing; it\u2019s a sign that the End Times are coming. They also justify sexual slavery as a way of avoiding the sin of adultery or premarital sex, because if you have sex with a slave, it\u2019s not really sex, or so they claim. They can be pedophiles.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Why is religion such a useful framework or pretext for terrorism, subjugation, and genocide?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> ISIS is a millenarian movement. They want to create a new human being the same way the Soviets wanted to create a new human being. They want to recreate humanity, and they want to create a purified world. It\u2019s a cosmic battle to them. It\u2019s not totally different from communism or other ideologies, but God is a pretty compelling citation.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Does religion give it a patina of righteousness or defuse any accusations that this is a mere power grab?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> I think religion is often a patina or marketing strategy for terrorists to accomplish more worldly goals. In the case of ISIS, many of the leaders are former Baathists, the secular political party that ruled Iraq prior to the 2003 invasion. [Abu Bakr al-] Baghdadi, the \u201ccaliph\u201d of the Islamic State, recruited former military and intelligence personnel from Saddam Hussein\u2019s Iraq. They have important, useful skills. ISIS\u2019s religious agenda is clearly intermingled with its more secular goals. ISIS is capitalizing on the feeling among Sunni Muslims that they are under threat in the new Iraq, and that ISIS is the only protection they have from the Iraqi leadership\u2019s anti-Sunni, sectarian policies.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> In human history, where does ISIS rank in terms of what they\u2019ve been able to accomplish \u2014 their lethality and their organizational strength \u2014 in such a brief amount of time?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Compared with modern terrorist organizations that we know, they rank very high. However, compared with the Khmer Rouge, the Nazis, the communists, they rank pretty low both in terms of their accomplishments and even in terms of their brutality. We\u2019ve seen much worse. ISIS is not just a terrorist group; it is also an insurgent army. While it\u2019s shocking to see how much territory ISIS acquired so quickly, we\u2019re comparing it with terrorist groups that weren\u2019t necessarily trying to acquire large amounts of territory. The ideology, the brutality of this group \u2014 I have to think they\u2019re going to self-destruct before they manage to spread as far as, say, the communists or the Nazis. The Nazis weren\u2019t advertising their atrocities; ISIS is publicizing its atrocities, flaunting its brutality. It\u2019s part of the End Times narrative that ISIS hopes to spin.<\/p>\n<p><em>This article has been lightly edited for length and clarity.<\/em><\/p>\n","innerContent":["\n\t\t<p><em>Family and friends describe them not as radicals, but as well-behaved and diligent students at a London private high school. So it came as a shock when the three British girls slipped their passports into handbags, casually walked out of their homes, and boarded a flight to Istanbul to join the Islamic State, or ISIS, in Syria last month. <\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>British authorities believe that the teenagers, who disappeared last month, were likely aided by <a href=\"http:\/\/www.theguardian.com\/world\/2014\/sep\/06\/scottish-woman-married-isis-fighter-martyr-aqsa-mahmood\">Aqsa Mahmood<\/a>, a young woman originally from Scotland who helps recruit for the extremist group.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>The trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.wnyc.org\/story\/new-york-city-produces-its-first-homegrown-isis-recruits\/\">latest<\/a> among a <a href=\"http:\/\/www.usatoday.com\/story\/news\/nation\/2014\/10\/06\/isis-arrested-terrorism-us-teenager-chicago-ohare\/16810803\/\">growing<\/a> <a href=\"http:\/\/www.cnn.com\/2014\/09\/10\/justice\/colorado-jihadist-guilty-plea\/index.html\">number<\/a> of teenagers and <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/local\/crime\/northern-va-teen-thought-to-have-helped-man-join-islamic-state\/2015\/03\/04\/51c7ec34-c1e6-11e4-ad5c-3b8ce89f1b89_story.html\">young adults<\/a> from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, <a href=\"http:\/\/rt.com\/news\/228415-isis-canadian-female-tweets\/\">Canada<\/a>, and various <a href=\"http:\/\/www.independent.co.uk\/news\/world\/europe\/belgian-isis-fighter-taunts-authorities-saying-he-slipped-out-of-country-like-knife-through-butter-9983534.html\">European nations<\/a> who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. In late February, the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/world\/national-security\/jihadi-john-the-islamic-state-killer-behind-the-mask-is-a-young-londoner\/2015\/02\/25\/d6dbab16-bc43-11e4-bdfa-b8e8f594e6ee_story.html\">Washington Post<\/a> identified \u201cJihadi John,\u201d the masked man seen in several ISIS videos beheading hostages, as a college-educated computer programmer from a well-off family in West London. Although a precise figure isn\u2019t known, Lt. Gen. James Clapper, director of U.S. national intelligence, told Congress last month that an estimated 3,400 citizens from Western countries have traveled to Iraq and Syria, presumably to join ISIS. <\/em><\/p>\n<p><em><a href=\"http:\/\/jessicasternbooks.com\/about\/\">Jessica E. Stern<\/a>, Ph.D. \u201992, is a fellow at the <a href=\"http:\/\/fxb.harvard.edu\">FXB Center for Health and Human Rights<\/a> at the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.hsph.harvard.edu\/\">Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health<\/a> (HSPH) and a lecturer in the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.gov.harvard.edu\/\">Government Department<\/a> at Harvard\u2019s <a href=\"http:\/\/www.fas.harvard.edu\/\">Faculty of Arts and Sciences<\/a> (FAS). She serves on the Hoover Institution Task Force on National Security and Law and was a member of the National Security Council staff during the Clinton administration. Stern has <a href=\"http:\/\/jessicasternbooks.com\/books\/terror-in-the-name-of-god\/\">written extensively<\/a> about terrorism and violent extremists. Her <a href=\"http:\/\/www.press.org\/events\/book-rap-jessica-stern-jm-berger-isis-state-terror\">latest book<\/a>, \u201cISIS: The State of Terror,\u201d co-authored with <a href=\"http:\/\/www.brookings.edu\/experts\/bergerjm\">J.M. Berger<\/a>, will be released March 24. Stern spoke with the Gazette about how and why ISIS has been increasingly effective in luring young Westerners to its side.<\/em><strong><br \/>\n<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> We know that the so-called Islamic State is extraordinarily media-savvy. What social-media platforms have been most effective in reaching Western recruits?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> There\u2019s been a lot of activity on Twitter. Aqsa Mahmood is a good example. She\u2019s been accused of enticing the three young women from London who apparently left their homes to join the Islamic State. She\u2019s also known as Umm Layth, which means \u201cmother of the lion.\u201d She spoke to them on Twitter, and then they ended up moving to an encrypted platform to continue their discussion, which is a common recruitment tactic. [Mahmood] also answers questions on Ask.fm. Somehow her postings are attracting young women, some of them very high-achieving, to leave home to join the jihad.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s a big debate about what should be taken off Twitter and whether Twitter is inadvertently facilitating terrorist recruitment. Twitter\u2019s automated list of \u201cwho to follow\u201d makes it easy for a person interested in ISIS to rapidly find additional ISIS supporters. Sometimes, ISIS accounts are suspended, but often, shortly afterward, a new account with a new name appears, which serious followers can find.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s a debate among those who think we should allow those accounts to remain active, and those who think that Twitter should be suspending terrorist accounts. Those who say that the accounts should be left alone argue that they\u2019re a good way to gather intelligence, and that removing them would only result in recruiters moving to a less-transparent platform. Those who want the accounts shut down say that private companies should not allow ISIS and other groups to use social media to recruit followers, and that terrorists\u2019 use of social media to promote violence does not constitute protected speech. Twitter recently suspended over 2,000 ISIS-related accounts. ISIS has now declared war against Twitter, threatening the lives of its staff.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the pitch to male and female potential recruits?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> For the men, it\u2019s, \u201cCome and fight if you can fight; if you can\u2019t fight we also need doctors, we need social-media experts, engineers \u2026 We\u2019re running a state, and so if you feel you can\u2019t handle fighting, we can still use you.\u201d The women are often recruited to marry jihadists: \u201cYou can participate in the jihad by marrying. You can be the mother of the next generation.\u201d It is a fairly traditional female role.<\/p>\n<p>There are tremendous social benefits for recruits: You\u2019re making a world a better place, or so the group claims, which provides a kind of spiritual reward. There\u2019s financial reward for the fighters. ISIS actually pays the fighters, gives them free housing, offers to provide them wives. Hence, the need to recruit young women. There\u2019s also the tremendous lure of extreme fundamentalism. I think we can all understand the appeal: Wouldn\u2019t it be nice to have easy answers to every morally complex question? Inside a group like ISIS, life becomes morally simple. The rules are clear. Good and evil come out in stark relief.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What\u2019s the psychological profile of those people most susceptible to their message?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> We don\u2019t have a profile of the Westerners joining ISIS yet because there haven\u2019t been large studies. But I can tell you that [British intelligence agency] MI5 did a study of Westerners who were involved in or closely associated with extremist activity, prior to ISIS\u2019s recent recruitment drive. They found that a surprisingly high number of them were converts to Islam. Many in the MI5 study were relatively ignorant of Islam, even if they were Muslim. Umm Layth is a good example. She grew up in a secular Muslim family and went from relative ignorance about Islam to recruiting for ISIS.<\/p>\n<p>An important factor seems to be the desire to forge a new identity, an identity with dignity. I interviewed terrorists for many years and I can tell you that identity is often absolutely key. We also know that there is a higher rate of mental illness among so-called lone wolves, people who are inspired (often online) to commit terrorist actions without physically joining an extremist group. Studies of Westerners joining jihadi organizations, prior to ISIS\u2019s recruitment drive, have shown that foreign fighters tend to be alienated or marginalized within their own societies; they may have had a bad encounter with police or distrust local authorities. They tend to disapprove of their nation\u2019s foreign policies. If they\u2019re living in an ethnic enclave, they\u2019re likely to be alienated from people living alongside them, as well as the country as a whole, whether it\u2019s the United States, or the U.K. or elsewhere in the West. For those who join ISIS, I think that there\u2019s got to be an element of thrill-seeking as well, perhaps even an attraction to violence. It\u2019s hard for me to imagine that anybody who gets recruited today doesn\u2019t know about ISIS\u2019s extreme brutality.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Is the impulse to join the Islamic State very different from, say, the idealistic impulse of young people to join the Peace Corps or a nongovernmental organization, or any global organization they believe is doing important and uplifting work?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Many of the people who join terrorist organizations believe they are making the world a better place. They see pictures of [Syrian leader Bashar] Assad\u2019s brutality against his own people, and they feel the desire to help. That sense of righteousness is a very appealing aspect of joining a terrorist group, for some. But I would say in some ways it\u2019s more like joining the Weather Underground than the Peace Corps. At this point, it\u2019s hard to imagine anyone joining without knowing that they\u2019re going to be involved in real atrocities.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> But in their minds, those actions are righteous.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Absolutely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> How effective is Mahmood as a recruiter, and what makes these Western recruiters so successful? Do they tend to be true believers or mere cynical mercenaries?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> She is very effective. My guess is that it\u2019s partly because she knows how to relate to young women like herself. She knows their lives. ISIS is using Westerners to run the social media campaign to recruit Westerners.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> The State Department has recently announced that it has stepped up its counter-messaging efforts. What are they doing, and is that likely to be sufficient, given the sophisticated and prolific nature of the Islamic State?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> They have a program called \u201cThink Again Turn Away,\u201d and if you look at what they\u2019ve been doing and compare it with what ISIS has been doing, it\u2019s so boring. ISIS has professional cameramen. \u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> The ISIS production values are quite high. It\u2019s not like the old al-Qaida training videos we used to see.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> No, it\u2019s not. If you look at what the State Department puts out, sadly, you can tell that they didn\u2019t have a lot of money. But the guy who ran that program told me, \u201cLook, I know we can\u2019t compete with the video imagery showing, \u2018Here\u2019s your chance to create this very pure state, and you\u2019re going to get to kill infidels and Shiites.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> They can\u2019t compete on the messaging or on the production values?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Both. ISIS has made an enemy of the entire world, other than those who join it. I hope that we\u2019re going to get much more serious \u2014 we outside the government \u2014 to find ways to respond. There is a program that I\u2019d like to bring to Harvard. I\u2019ve been advocating for years to have young people design counter-messaging programs, rather than State Department employees or Madison Avenue. There is an organization, EdVenture Partners, that created a curriculum for students around the world to compete to create the most effective counter-messaging. The students will create digital platforms to amplify the messages of clerics who can argue against ISIS\u2019 interpretation of Islam, or of former members of ISIS who turned against the organization. Those are just two examples; there are all kinds of things that can be done. The initiative is called \u201cP2P: Challenging Extremism.\u201d I would love to get students from across the University, students in engineering, students in political science, students who speak languages, or who are very good at communications \u2026 ideally we want a completely interdisciplinary group. I\u2019m just so excited about this.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Besides better coordinating the State Department\u2019s fragmented messaging efforts, I wonder if that\u2019s ever going to be sufficient compared to the prolific nature of ISIS. I understand they\u2019re <a href=\"http:\/\/www.politifact.com\/punditfact\/statements\/2015\/feb\/19\/hillary-mann-leverett\/cnn-expert-islamic-state-posts-90000-social-media-\/\">sending out<\/a> as many as 200,000 social media messages per day.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> No. It\u2019s never going to be enough. I think the private sector has to get involved. I\u2019m hoping Harvard alumni will be inspired to get involved.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the Islamic State\u2019s end game? Is it to provoke global Armageddon, or does it want to control the world and have everyone live under its terms?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> They want to establish a worldwide caliphate. The dream is to take over the world. They are also obsessed with the Apocalypse. Although ISIS claims to justify its actions by referring to religious texts, ordinary Muslims have no idea what ISIS is talking about. The Quran is not an apocalyptic book, so ISIS has to borrow from different apocalyptic narratives. Their online English language magazine, it\u2019s called Dabiq, which is the name of the town where ISIS believes the final battle of the Apocalypse will take place.<\/p>\n<p>They believe that sexually enslaving women who are from religious minorities is a good thing; it\u2019s a sign that the End Times are coming. They also justify sexual slavery as a way of avoiding the sin of adultery or premarital sex, because if you have sex with a slave, it\u2019s not really sex, or so they claim. They can be pedophiles.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Why is religion such a useful framework or pretext for terrorism, subjugation, and genocide?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> ISIS is a millenarian movement. They want to create a new human being the same way the Soviets wanted to create a new human being. They want to recreate humanity, and they want to create a purified world. It\u2019s a cosmic battle to them. It\u2019s not totally different from communism or other ideologies, but God is a pretty compelling citation.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Does religion give it a patina of righteousness or defuse any accusations that this is a mere power grab?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> I think religion is often a patina or marketing strategy for terrorists to accomplish more worldly goals. In the case of ISIS, many of the leaders are former Baathists, the secular political party that ruled Iraq prior to the 2003 invasion. [Abu Bakr al-] Baghdadi, the \u201ccaliph\u201d of the Islamic State, recruited former military and intelligence personnel from Saddam Hussein\u2019s Iraq. They have important, useful skills. ISIS\u2019s religious agenda is clearly intermingled with its more secular goals. ISIS is capitalizing on the feeling among Sunni Muslims that they are under threat in the new Iraq, and that ISIS is the only protection they have from the Iraqi leadership\u2019s anti-Sunni, sectarian policies.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> In human history, where does ISIS rank in terms of what they\u2019ve been able to accomplish \u2014 their lethality and their organizational strength \u2014 in such a brief amount of time?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Compared with modern terrorist organizations that we know, they rank very high. However, compared with the Khmer Rouge, the Nazis, the communists, they rank pretty low both in terms of their accomplishments and even in terms of their brutality. We\u2019ve seen much worse. ISIS is not just a terrorist group; it is also an insurgent army. While it\u2019s shocking to see how much territory ISIS acquired so quickly, we\u2019re comparing it with terrorist groups that weren\u2019t necessarily trying to acquire large amounts of territory. The ideology, the brutality of this group \u2014 I have to think they\u2019re going to self-destruct before they manage to spread as far as, say, the communists or the Nazis. The Nazis weren\u2019t advertising their atrocities; ISIS is publicizing its atrocities, flaunting its brutality. It\u2019s part of the End Times narrative that ISIS hopes to spin.<\/p>\n<p><em>This article has been lightly edited for length and clarity.<\/em><\/p>\n"],"rendered":"\n\t\t<p><em>Family and friends describe them not as radicals, but as well-behaved and diligent students at a London private high school. So it came as a shock when the three British girls slipped their passports into handbags, casually walked out of their homes, and boarded a flight to Istanbul to join the Islamic State, or ISIS, in Syria last month. <\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>British authorities believe that the teenagers, who disappeared last month, were likely aided by <a href=\"http:\/\/www.theguardian.com\/world\/2014\/sep\/06\/scottish-woman-married-isis-fighter-martyr-aqsa-mahmood\">Aqsa Mahmood<\/a>, a young woman originally from Scotland who helps recruit for the extremist group.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>The trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.wnyc.org\/story\/new-york-city-produces-its-first-homegrown-isis-recruits\/\">latest<\/a> among a <a href=\"http:\/\/www.usatoday.com\/story\/news\/nation\/2014\/10\/06\/isis-arrested-terrorism-us-teenager-chicago-ohare\/16810803\/\">growing<\/a> <a href=\"http:\/\/www.cnn.com\/2014\/09\/10\/justice\/colorado-jihadist-guilty-plea\/index.html\">number<\/a> of teenagers and <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/local\/crime\/northern-va-teen-thought-to-have-helped-man-join-islamic-state\/2015\/03\/04\/51c7ec34-c1e6-11e4-ad5c-3b8ce89f1b89_story.html\">young adults<\/a> from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, <a href=\"http:\/\/rt.com\/news\/228415-isis-canadian-female-tweets\/\">Canada<\/a>, and various <a href=\"http:\/\/www.independent.co.uk\/news\/world\/europe\/belgian-isis-fighter-taunts-authorities-saying-he-slipped-out-of-country-like-knife-through-butter-9983534.html\">European nations<\/a> who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. In late February, the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/world\/national-security\/jihadi-john-the-islamic-state-killer-behind-the-mask-is-a-young-londoner\/2015\/02\/25\/d6dbab16-bc43-11e4-bdfa-b8e8f594e6ee_story.html\">Washington Post<\/a> identified \u201cJihadi John,\u201d the masked man seen in several ISIS videos beheading hostages, as a college-educated computer programmer from a well-off family in West London. Although a precise figure isn\u2019t known, Lt. Gen. James Clapper, director of U.S. national intelligence, told Congress last month that an estimated 3,400 citizens from Western countries have traveled to Iraq and Syria, presumably to join ISIS. <\/em><\/p>\n<p><em><a href=\"http:\/\/jessicasternbooks.com\/about\/\">Jessica E. Stern<\/a>, Ph.D. \u201992, is a fellow at the <a href=\"http:\/\/fxb.harvard.edu\">FXB Center for Health and Human Rights<\/a> at the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.hsph.harvard.edu\/\">Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health<\/a> (HSPH) and a lecturer in the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.gov.harvard.edu\/\">Government Department<\/a> at Harvard\u2019s <a href=\"http:\/\/www.fas.harvard.edu\/\">Faculty of Arts and Sciences<\/a> (FAS). She serves on the Hoover Institution Task Force on National Security and Law and was a member of the National Security Council staff during the Clinton administration. Stern has <a href=\"http:\/\/jessicasternbooks.com\/books\/terror-in-the-name-of-god\/\">written extensively<\/a> about terrorism and violent extremists. Her <a href=\"http:\/\/www.press.org\/events\/book-rap-jessica-stern-jm-berger-isis-state-terror\">latest book<\/a>, \u201cISIS: The State of Terror,\u201d co-authored with <a href=\"http:\/\/www.brookings.edu\/experts\/bergerjm\">J.M. Berger<\/a>, will be released March 24. Stern spoke with the Gazette about how and why ISIS has been increasingly effective in luring young Westerners to its side.<\/em><strong><br \/>\n<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> We know that the so-called Islamic State is extraordinarily media-savvy. What social-media platforms have been most effective in reaching Western recruits?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> There\u2019s been a lot of activity on Twitter. Aqsa Mahmood is a good example. She\u2019s been accused of enticing the three young women from London who apparently left their homes to join the Islamic State. She\u2019s also known as Umm Layth, which means \u201cmother of the lion.\u201d She spoke to them on Twitter, and then they ended up moving to an encrypted platform to continue their discussion, which is a common recruitment tactic. [Mahmood] also answers questions on Ask.fm. Somehow her postings are attracting young women, some of them very high-achieving, to leave home to join the jihad.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s a big debate about what should be taken off Twitter and whether Twitter is inadvertently facilitating terrorist recruitment. Twitter\u2019s automated list of \u201cwho to follow\u201d makes it easy for a person interested in ISIS to rapidly find additional ISIS supporters. Sometimes, ISIS accounts are suspended, but often, shortly afterward, a new account with a new name appears, which serious followers can find.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s a debate among those who think we should allow those accounts to remain active, and those who think that Twitter should be suspending terrorist accounts. Those who say that the accounts should be left alone argue that they\u2019re a good way to gather intelligence, and that removing them would only result in recruiters moving to a less-transparent platform. Those who want the accounts shut down say that private companies should not allow ISIS and other groups to use social media to recruit followers, and that terrorists\u2019 use of social media to promote violence does not constitute protected speech. Twitter recently suspended over 2,000 ISIS-related accounts. ISIS has now declared war against Twitter, threatening the lives of its staff.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the pitch to male and female potential recruits?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> For the men, it\u2019s, \u201cCome and fight if you can fight; if you can\u2019t fight we also need doctors, we need social-media experts, engineers \u2026 We\u2019re running a state, and so if you feel you can\u2019t handle fighting, we can still use you.\u201d The women are often recruited to marry jihadists: \u201cYou can participate in the jihad by marrying. You can be the mother of the next generation.\u201d It is a fairly traditional female role.<\/p>\n<p>There are tremendous social benefits for recruits: You\u2019re making a world a better place, or so the group claims, which provides a kind of spiritual reward. There\u2019s financial reward for the fighters. ISIS actually pays the fighters, gives them free housing, offers to provide them wives. Hence, the need to recruit young women. There\u2019s also the tremendous lure of extreme fundamentalism. I think we can all understand the appeal: Wouldn\u2019t it be nice to have easy answers to every morally complex question? Inside a group like ISIS, life becomes morally simple. The rules are clear. Good and evil come out in stark relief.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What\u2019s the psychological profile of those people most susceptible to their message?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> We don\u2019t have a profile of the Westerners joining ISIS yet because there haven\u2019t been large studies. But I can tell you that [British intelligence agency] MI5 did a study of Westerners who were involved in or closely associated with extremist activity, prior to ISIS\u2019s recent recruitment drive. They found that a surprisingly high number of them were converts to Islam. Many in the MI5 study were relatively ignorant of Islam, even if they were Muslim. Umm Layth is a good example. She grew up in a secular Muslim family and went from relative ignorance about Islam to recruiting for ISIS.<\/p>\n<p>An important factor seems to be the desire to forge a new identity, an identity with dignity. I interviewed terrorists for many years and I can tell you that identity is often absolutely key. We also know that there is a higher rate of mental illness among so-called lone wolves, people who are inspired (often online) to commit terrorist actions without physically joining an extremist group. Studies of Westerners joining jihadi organizations, prior to ISIS\u2019s recruitment drive, have shown that foreign fighters tend to be alienated or marginalized within their own societies; they may have had a bad encounter with police or distrust local authorities. They tend to disapprove of their nation\u2019s foreign policies. If they\u2019re living in an ethnic enclave, they\u2019re likely to be alienated from people living alongside them, as well as the country as a whole, whether it\u2019s the United States, or the U.K. or elsewhere in the West. For those who join ISIS, I think that there\u2019s got to be an element of thrill-seeking as well, perhaps even an attraction to violence. It\u2019s hard for me to imagine that anybody who gets recruited today doesn\u2019t know about ISIS\u2019s extreme brutality.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Is the impulse to join the Islamic State very different from, say, the idealistic impulse of young people to join the Peace Corps or a nongovernmental organization, or any global organization they believe is doing important and uplifting work?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Many of the people who join terrorist organizations believe they are making the world a better place. They see pictures of [Syrian leader Bashar] Assad\u2019s brutality against his own people, and they feel the desire to help. That sense of righteousness is a very appealing aspect of joining a terrorist group, for some. But I would say in some ways it\u2019s more like joining the Weather Underground than the Peace Corps. At this point, it\u2019s hard to imagine anyone joining without knowing that they\u2019re going to be involved in real atrocities.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> But in their minds, those actions are righteous.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Absolutely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> How effective is Mahmood as a recruiter, and what makes these Western recruiters so successful? Do they tend to be true believers or mere cynical mercenaries?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> She is very effective. My guess is that it\u2019s partly because she knows how to relate to young women like herself. She knows their lives. ISIS is using Westerners to run the social media campaign to recruit Westerners.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> The State Department has recently announced that it has stepped up its counter-messaging efforts. What are they doing, and is that likely to be sufficient, given the sophisticated and prolific nature of the Islamic State?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> They have a program called \u201cThink Again Turn Away,\u201d and if you look at what they\u2019ve been doing and compare it with what ISIS has been doing, it\u2019s so boring. ISIS has professional cameramen. \u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> The ISIS production values are quite high. It\u2019s not like the old al-Qaida training videos we used to see.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> No, it\u2019s not. If you look at what the State Department puts out, sadly, you can tell that they didn\u2019t have a lot of money. But the guy who ran that program told me, \u201cLook, I know we can\u2019t compete with the video imagery showing, \u2018Here\u2019s your chance to create this very pure state, and you\u2019re going to get to kill infidels and Shiites.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> They can\u2019t compete on the messaging or on the production values?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Both. ISIS has made an enemy of the entire world, other than those who join it. I hope that we\u2019re going to get much more serious \u2014 we outside the government \u2014 to find ways to respond. There is a program that I\u2019d like to bring to Harvard. I\u2019ve been advocating for years to have young people design counter-messaging programs, rather than State Department employees or Madison Avenue. There is an organization, EdVenture Partners, that created a curriculum for students around the world to compete to create the most effective counter-messaging. The students will create digital platforms to amplify the messages of clerics who can argue against ISIS\u2019 interpretation of Islam, or of former members of ISIS who turned against the organization. Those are just two examples; there are all kinds of things that can be done. The initiative is called \u201cP2P: Challenging Extremism.\u201d I would love to get students from across the University, students in engineering, students in political science, students who speak languages, or who are very good at communications \u2026 ideally we want a completely interdisciplinary group. I\u2019m just so excited about this.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Besides better coordinating the State Department\u2019s fragmented messaging efforts, I wonder if that\u2019s ever going to be sufficient compared to the prolific nature of ISIS. I understand they\u2019re <a href=\"http:\/\/www.politifact.com\/punditfact\/statements\/2015\/feb\/19\/hillary-mann-leverett\/cnn-expert-islamic-state-posts-90000-social-media-\/\">sending out<\/a> as many as 200,000 social media messages per day.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> No. It\u2019s never going to be enough. I think the private sector has to get involved. I\u2019m hoping Harvard alumni will be inspired to get involved.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the Islamic State\u2019s end game? Is it to provoke global Armageddon, or does it want to control the world and have everyone live under its terms?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> They want to establish a worldwide caliphate. The dream is to take over the world. They are also obsessed with the Apocalypse. Although ISIS claims to justify its actions by referring to religious texts, ordinary Muslims have no idea what ISIS is talking about. The Quran is not an apocalyptic book, so ISIS has to borrow from different apocalyptic narratives. Their online English language magazine, it\u2019s called Dabiq, which is the name of the town where ISIS believes the final battle of the Apocalypse will take place.<\/p>\n<p>They believe that sexually enslaving women who are from religious minorities is a good thing; it\u2019s a sign that the End Times are coming. They also justify sexual slavery as a way of avoiding the sin of adultery or premarital sex, because if you have sex with a slave, it\u2019s not really sex, or so they claim. They can be pedophiles.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Why is religion such a useful framework or pretext for terrorism, subjugation, and genocide?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> ISIS is a millenarian movement. They want to create a new human being the same way the Soviets wanted to create a new human being. They want to recreate humanity, and they want to create a purified world. It\u2019s a cosmic battle to them. It\u2019s not totally different from communism or other ideologies, but God is a pretty compelling citation.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Does religion give it a patina of righteousness or defuse any accusations that this is a mere power grab?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> I think religion is often a patina or marketing strategy for terrorists to accomplish more worldly goals. In the case of ISIS, many of the leaders are former Baathists, the secular political party that ruled Iraq prior to the 2003 invasion. [Abu Bakr al-] Baghdadi, the \u201ccaliph\u201d of the Islamic State, recruited former military and intelligence personnel from Saddam Hussein\u2019s Iraq. They have important, useful skills. ISIS\u2019s religious agenda is clearly intermingled with its more secular goals. ISIS is capitalizing on the feeling among Sunni Muslims that they are under threat in the new Iraq, and that ISIS is the only protection they have from the Iraqi leadership\u2019s anti-Sunni, sectarian policies.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> In human history, where does ISIS rank in terms of what they\u2019ve been able to accomplish \u2014 their lethality and their organizational strength \u2014 in such a brief amount of time?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Compared with modern terrorist organizations that we know, they rank very high. However, compared with the Khmer Rouge, the Nazis, the communists, they rank pretty low both in terms of their accomplishments and even in terms of their brutality. We\u2019ve seen much worse. ISIS is not just a terrorist group; it is also an insurgent army. While it\u2019s shocking to see how much territory ISIS acquired so quickly, we\u2019re comparing it with terrorist groups that weren\u2019t necessarily trying to acquire large amounts of territory. The ideology, the brutality of this group \u2014 I have to think they\u2019re going to self-destruct before they manage to spread as far as, say, the communists or the Nazis. The Nazis weren\u2019t advertising their atrocities; ISIS is publicizing its atrocities, flaunting its brutality. It\u2019s part of the End Times narrative that ISIS hopes to spin.<\/p>\n<p><em>This article has been lightly edited for length and clarity.<\/em><\/p>\n"}],"innerHTML":"\n<div class=\"wp-block-group alignwide\">\n\n\n\n<\/div>\n","innerContent":["\n<div class=\"wp-block-group alignwide\">\n\n","\n\n<\/div>\n"],"rendered":"\n<div class=\"wp-block-group alignwide has-global-padding is-content-justification-center is-layout-constrained wp-block-group-is-layout-constrained\">\n\n\n\t\t<p><em>Family and friends describe them not as radicals, but as well-behaved and diligent students at a London private high school. So it came as a shock when the three British girls slipped their passports into handbags, casually walked out of their homes, and boarded a flight to Istanbul to join the Islamic State, or ISIS, in Syria last month. <\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>British authorities believe that the teenagers, who disappeared last month, were likely aided by <a href=\"http:\/\/www.theguardian.com\/world\/2014\/sep\/06\/scottish-woman-married-isis-fighter-martyr-aqsa-mahmood\">Aqsa Mahmood<\/a>, a young woman originally from Scotland who helps recruit for the extremist group.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>The trio\u2019s highly publicized defection to Syria, as well as the apprehension of three young British males in Istanbul this week as they headed to join ISIS, are just the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.wnyc.org\/story\/new-york-city-produces-its-first-homegrown-isis-recruits\/\">latest<\/a> among a <a href=\"http:\/\/www.usatoday.com\/story\/news\/nation\/2014\/10\/06\/isis-arrested-terrorism-us-teenager-chicago-ohare\/16810803\/\">growing<\/a> <a href=\"http:\/\/www.cnn.com\/2014\/09\/10\/justice\/colorado-jihadist-guilty-plea\/index.html\">number<\/a> of teenagers and <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/local\/crime\/northern-va-teen-thought-to-have-helped-man-join-islamic-state\/2015\/03\/04\/51c7ec34-c1e6-11e4-ad5c-3b8ce89f1b89_story.html\">young adults<\/a> from middle-class, educated, often suburban backgrounds in Britain, the United States, <a href=\"http:\/\/rt.com\/news\/228415-isis-canadian-female-tweets\/\">Canada<\/a>, and various <a href=\"http:\/\/www.independent.co.uk\/news\/world\/europe\/belgian-isis-fighter-taunts-authorities-saying-he-slipped-out-of-country-like-knife-through-butter-9983534.html\">European nations<\/a> who have been enticed to abandon their comfortable lives and join the Islamic State since last summer. In late February, the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.washingtonpost.com\/world\/national-security\/jihadi-john-the-islamic-state-killer-behind-the-mask-is-a-young-londoner\/2015\/02\/25\/d6dbab16-bc43-11e4-bdfa-b8e8f594e6ee_story.html\">Washington Post<\/a> identified \u201cJihadi John,\u201d the masked man seen in several ISIS videos beheading hostages, as a college-educated computer programmer from a well-off family in West London. Although a precise figure isn\u2019t known, Lt. Gen. James Clapper, director of U.S. national intelligence, told Congress last month that an estimated 3,400 citizens from Western countries have traveled to Iraq and Syria, presumably to join ISIS. <\/em><\/p>\n<p><em><a href=\"http:\/\/jessicasternbooks.com\/about\/\">Jessica E. Stern<\/a>, Ph.D. \u201992, is a fellow at the <a href=\"http:\/\/fxb.harvard.edu\">FXB Center for Health and Human Rights<\/a> at the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.hsph.harvard.edu\/\">Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health<\/a> (HSPH) and a lecturer in the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.gov.harvard.edu\/\">Government Department<\/a> at Harvard\u2019s <a href=\"http:\/\/www.fas.harvard.edu\/\">Faculty of Arts and Sciences<\/a> (FAS). She serves on the Hoover Institution Task Force on National Security and Law and was a member of the National Security Council staff during the Clinton administration. Stern has <a href=\"http:\/\/jessicasternbooks.com\/books\/terror-in-the-name-of-god\/\">written extensively<\/a> about terrorism and violent extremists. Her <a href=\"http:\/\/www.press.org\/events\/book-rap-jessica-stern-jm-berger-isis-state-terror\">latest book<\/a>, \u201cISIS: The State of Terror,\u201d co-authored with <a href=\"http:\/\/www.brookings.edu\/experts\/bergerjm\">J.M. Berger<\/a>, will be released March 24. Stern spoke with the Gazette about how and why ISIS has been increasingly effective in luring young Westerners to its side.<\/em><strong><br \/>\n<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> We know that the so-called Islamic State is extraordinarily media-savvy. What social-media platforms have been most effective in reaching Western recruits?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> There\u2019s been a lot of activity on Twitter. Aqsa Mahmood is a good example. She\u2019s been accused of enticing the three young women from London who apparently left their homes to join the Islamic State. She\u2019s also known as Umm Layth, which means \u201cmother of the lion.\u201d She spoke to them on Twitter, and then they ended up moving to an encrypted platform to continue their discussion, which is a common recruitment tactic. [Mahmood] also answers questions on Ask.fm. Somehow her postings are attracting young women, some of them very high-achieving, to leave home to join the jihad.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s a big debate about what should be taken off Twitter and whether Twitter is inadvertently facilitating terrorist recruitment. Twitter\u2019s automated list of \u201cwho to follow\u201d makes it easy for a person interested in ISIS to rapidly find additional ISIS supporters. Sometimes, ISIS accounts are suspended, but often, shortly afterward, a new account with a new name appears, which serious followers can find.<\/p>\n<p>There\u2019s a debate among those who think we should allow those accounts to remain active, and those who think that Twitter should be suspending terrorist accounts. Those who say that the accounts should be left alone argue that they\u2019re a good way to gather intelligence, and that removing them would only result in recruiters moving to a less-transparent platform. Those who want the accounts shut down say that private companies should not allow ISIS and other groups to use social media to recruit followers, and that terrorists\u2019 use of social media to promote violence does not constitute protected speech. Twitter recently suspended over 2,000 ISIS-related accounts. ISIS has now declared war against Twitter, threatening the lives of its staff.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the pitch to male and female potential recruits?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> For the men, it\u2019s, \u201cCome and fight if you can fight; if you can\u2019t fight we also need doctors, we need social-media experts, engineers \u2026 We\u2019re running a state, and so if you feel you can\u2019t handle fighting, we can still use you.\u201d The women are often recruited to marry jihadists: \u201cYou can participate in the jihad by marrying. You can be the mother of the next generation.\u201d It is a fairly traditional female role.<\/p>\n<p>There are tremendous social benefits for recruits: You\u2019re making a world a better place, or so the group claims, which provides a kind of spiritual reward. There\u2019s financial reward for the fighters. ISIS actually pays the fighters, gives them free housing, offers to provide them wives. Hence, the need to recruit young women. There\u2019s also the tremendous lure of extreme fundamentalism. I think we can all understand the appeal: Wouldn\u2019t it be nice to have easy answers to every morally complex question? Inside a group like ISIS, life becomes morally simple. The rules are clear. Good and evil come out in stark relief.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What\u2019s the psychological profile of those people most susceptible to their message?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> We don\u2019t have a profile of the Westerners joining ISIS yet because there haven\u2019t been large studies. But I can tell you that [British intelligence agency] MI5 did a study of Westerners who were involved in or closely associated with extremist activity, prior to ISIS\u2019s recent recruitment drive. They found that a surprisingly high number of them were converts to Islam. Many in the MI5 study were relatively ignorant of Islam, even if they were Muslim. Umm Layth is a good example. She grew up in a secular Muslim family and went from relative ignorance about Islam to recruiting for ISIS.<\/p>\n<p>An important factor seems to be the desire to forge a new identity, an identity with dignity. I interviewed terrorists for many years and I can tell you that identity is often absolutely key. We also know that there is a higher rate of mental illness among so-called lone wolves, people who are inspired (often online) to commit terrorist actions without physically joining an extremist group. Studies of Westerners joining jihadi organizations, prior to ISIS\u2019s recruitment drive, have shown that foreign fighters tend to be alienated or marginalized within their own societies; they may have had a bad encounter with police or distrust local authorities. They tend to disapprove of their nation\u2019s foreign policies. If they\u2019re living in an ethnic enclave, they\u2019re likely to be alienated from people living alongside them, as well as the country as a whole, whether it\u2019s the United States, or the U.K. or elsewhere in the West. For those who join ISIS, I think that there\u2019s got to be an element of thrill-seeking as well, perhaps even an attraction to violence. It\u2019s hard for me to imagine that anybody who gets recruited today doesn\u2019t know about ISIS\u2019s extreme brutality.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Is the impulse to join the Islamic State very different from, say, the idealistic impulse of young people to join the Peace Corps or a nongovernmental organization, or any global organization they believe is doing important and uplifting work?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Many of the people who join terrorist organizations believe they are making the world a better place. They see pictures of [Syrian leader Bashar] Assad\u2019s brutality against his own people, and they feel the desire to help. That sense of righteousness is a very appealing aspect of joining a terrorist group, for some. But I would say in some ways it\u2019s more like joining the Weather Underground than the Peace Corps. At this point, it\u2019s hard to imagine anyone joining without knowing that they\u2019re going to be involved in real atrocities.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> But in their minds, those actions are righteous.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Absolutely.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> How effective is Mahmood as a recruiter, and what makes these Western recruiters so successful? Do they tend to be true believers or mere cynical mercenaries?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> She is very effective. My guess is that it\u2019s partly because she knows how to relate to young women like herself. She knows their lives. ISIS is using Westerners to run the social media campaign to recruit Westerners.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> The State Department has recently announced that it has stepped up its counter-messaging efforts. What are they doing, and is that likely to be sufficient, given the sophisticated and prolific nature of the Islamic State?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> They have a program called \u201cThink Again Turn Away,\u201d and if you look at what they\u2019ve been doing and compare it with what ISIS has been doing, it\u2019s so boring. ISIS has professional cameramen. \u2026<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> The ISIS production values are quite high. It\u2019s not like the old al-Qaida training videos we used to see.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> No, it\u2019s not. If you look at what the State Department puts out, sadly, you can tell that they didn\u2019t have a lot of money. But the guy who ran that program told me, \u201cLook, I know we can\u2019t compete with the video imagery showing, \u2018Here\u2019s your chance to create this very pure state, and you\u2019re going to get to kill infidels and Shiites.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> They can\u2019t compete on the messaging or on the production values?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Both. ISIS has made an enemy of the entire world, other than those who join it. I hope that we\u2019re going to get much more serious \u2014 we outside the government \u2014 to find ways to respond. There is a program that I\u2019d like to bring to Harvard. I\u2019ve been advocating for years to have young people design counter-messaging programs, rather than State Department employees or Madison Avenue. There is an organization, EdVenture Partners, that created a curriculum for students around the world to compete to create the most effective counter-messaging. The students will create digital platforms to amplify the messages of clerics who can argue against ISIS\u2019 interpretation of Islam, or of former members of ISIS who turned against the organization. Those are just two examples; there are all kinds of things that can be done. The initiative is called \u201cP2P: Challenging Extremism.\u201d I would love to get students from across the University, students in engineering, students in political science, students who speak languages, or who are very good at communications \u2026 ideally we want a completely interdisciplinary group. I\u2019m just so excited about this.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Besides better coordinating the State Department\u2019s fragmented messaging efforts, I wonder if that\u2019s ever going to be sufficient compared to the prolific nature of ISIS. I understand they\u2019re <a href=\"http:\/\/www.politifact.com\/punditfact\/statements\/2015\/feb\/19\/hillary-mann-leverett\/cnn-expert-islamic-state-posts-90000-social-media-\/\">sending out<\/a> as many as 200,000 social media messages per day.<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> No. It\u2019s never going to be enough. I think the private sector has to get involved. I\u2019m hoping Harvard alumni will be inspired to get involved.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> What is the Islamic State\u2019s end game? Is it to provoke global Armageddon, or does it want to control the world and have everyone live under its terms?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> They want to establish a worldwide caliphate. The dream is to take over the world. They are also obsessed with the Apocalypse. Although ISIS claims to justify its actions by referring to religious texts, ordinary Muslims have no idea what ISIS is talking about. The Quran is not an apocalyptic book, so ISIS has to borrow from different apocalyptic narratives. Their online English language magazine, it\u2019s called Dabiq, which is the name of the town where ISIS believes the final battle of the Apocalypse will take place.<\/p>\n<p>They believe that sexually enslaving women who are from religious minorities is a good thing; it\u2019s a sign that the End Times are coming. They also justify sexual slavery as a way of avoiding the sin of adultery or premarital sex, because if you have sex with a slave, it\u2019s not really sex, or so they claim. They can be pedophiles.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Why is religion such a useful framework or pretext for terrorism, subjugation, and genocide?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> ISIS is a millenarian movement. They want to create a new human being the same way the Soviets wanted to create a new human being. They want to recreate humanity, and they want to create a purified world. It\u2019s a cosmic battle to them. It\u2019s not totally different from communism or other ideologies, but God is a pretty compelling citation.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> Does religion give it a patina of righteousness or defuse any accusations that this is a mere power grab?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> I think religion is often a patina or marketing strategy for terrorists to accomplish more worldly goals. In the case of ISIS, many of the leaders are former Baathists, the secular political party that ruled Iraq prior to the 2003 invasion. [Abu Bakr al-] Baghdadi, the \u201ccaliph\u201d of the Islamic State, recruited former military and intelligence personnel from Saddam Hussein\u2019s Iraq. They have important, useful skills. ISIS\u2019s religious agenda is clearly intermingled with its more secular goals. ISIS is capitalizing on the feeling among Sunni Muslims that they are under threat in the new Iraq, and that ISIS is the only protection they have from the Iraqi leadership\u2019s anti-Sunni, sectarian policies.<\/p>\n<p><strong>GAZETTE:<\/strong> In human history, where does ISIS rank in terms of what they\u2019ve been able to accomplish \u2014 their lethality and their organizational strength \u2014 in such a brief amount of time?<\/p>\n<p><strong>STERN:<\/strong> Compared with modern terrorist organizations that we know, they rank very high. However, compared with the Khmer Rouge, the Nazis, the communists, they rank pretty low both in terms of their accomplishments and even in terms of their brutality. We\u2019ve seen much worse. ISIS is not just a terrorist group; it is also an insurgent army. While it\u2019s shocking to see how much territory ISIS acquired so quickly, we\u2019re comparing it with terrorist groups that weren\u2019t necessarily trying to acquire large amounts of territory. The ideology, the brutality of this group \u2014 I have to think they\u2019re going to self-destruct before they manage to spread as far as, say, the communists or the Nazis. The Nazis weren\u2019t advertising their atrocities; ISIS is publicizing its atrocities, flaunting its brutality. It\u2019s part of the End Times narrative that ISIS hopes to spin.<\/p>\n<p><em>This article has been lightly edited for length and clarity.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n<\/div>\n"}},"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":183165,"url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2016\/05\/losing-the-war-on-jihadism\/","url_meta":{"origin":167258,"position":0},"title":"Losing the war on jihadism","author":"harvardgazette","date":"May 4, 2016","format":false,"excerpt":"Former top intelligence officials from the Central Intelligence Agency and Israel\u2019s Mossad discussed threats from the Islamic State, issues involving Israel, and the future of the Iran nuclear deal.","rel":"","context":"In "Nation & World"","block_context":{"text":"Nation & World","link":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/section\/nation-world\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/050416_spies_2371_605.jpg?resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/050416_spies_2371_605.jpg?resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/05\/050416_spies_2371_605.jpg?resize=525%2C300 1.5x"},"classes":[]},{"id":9244,"url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2006\/03\/distinguished-panel-explores-martyrdom\/","url_meta":{"origin":167258,"position":1},"title":"Distinguished panel explores ‘martyrdom’","author":"gazetteimport","date":"March 16, 2006","format":false,"excerpt":"If suicide terrorism is to be held in check, what's needed is an engaging, exciting \"counterperformance\" - whatever that might be - that can be offered in place of the \"theater of violence\" exemplified by the al-Qaida attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.","rel":"","context":"In "Campus & Community"","block_context":{"text":"Campus & Community","link":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/section\/campus-community\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":176468,"url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2015\/11\/deeper-crisis\/","url_meta":{"origin":167258,"position":2},"title":"Deeper crisis","author":"harvardgazette","date":"November 20, 2015","format":false,"excerpt":"Professors Jacqueline Bhabha and Michael Ignatieff talked about the Syrian refugee crisis in the wake of the Paris attacks in an event sponsored by the Mahindra Humanities Center.","rel":"","context":"In "Nation & World"","block_context":{"text":"Nation & World","link":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/section\/nation-world\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/11\/111715_refugee_crisis_021_605.jpg?resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/11\/111715_refugee_crisis_021_605.jpg?resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2015\/11\/111715_refugee_crisis_021_605.jpg?resize=525%2C300 1.5x"},"classes":[]},{"id":102793,"url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2012\/02\/act-big-dare-to-see-kaia-stern-harvard-thinks-big\/","url_meta":{"origin":167258,"position":3},"title":"Act Big: Dare to See – Kaia Stern – Harvard Thinks Big","author":"harvardgazette","date":"February 16, 2012","format":false,"excerpt":"Kaia Stern Director of the Prison Studies Project Visiting Faculty at Harvard Divinity School Visiting Faculty in Sociology at Harvard University Visiting Faculty in African and African American Studies at Harvard University","rel":"","context":"In "Campus & Community"","block_context":{"text":"Campus & Community","link":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/section\/campus-community\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":181428,"url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2016\/03\/a-new-phase-of-global-terrorism\/","url_meta":{"origin":167258,"position":4},"title":"A ‘new phase’ of global terrorism","author":"harvardgazette","date":"March 23, 2016","format":false,"excerpt":"U.S. Secretary of Homeland Security Jeh C. Johnson spoke to students at Harvard Kennedy School about the complex efforts that go into national security, particularly in the wake of terrorist attacks.","rel":"","context":"In "Nation & World"","block_context":{"text":"Nation & World","link":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/section\/nation-world\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/03\/032116_johnson_023_605.jpg?resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/03\/032116_johnson_023_605.jpg?resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/03\/032116_johnson_023_605.jpg?resize=525%2C300 1.5x"},"classes":[]},{"id":69611,"url":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/story\/2001\/12\/crash-course\/","url_meta":{"origin":167258,"position":5},"title":"Crash course","author":"gazetteimport","date":"December 13, 2001","format":false,"excerpt":"Unlike other days, Sept. 11 didnt end at midnight. The country still roils the reverberations of the terrorist attacks continue to be felt in spaces private and public, including this Universitys classrooms and in the quiet of professors research activities. Teachers and students alike struggle to understand, and respond to,\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "Campus & Community"","block_context":{"text":"Campus & Community","link":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/section\/campus-community\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/167258","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/105622744"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=167258"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/167258\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":267613,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/167258\/revisions\/267613"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/167260"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=167258"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=167258"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=167258"},{"taxonomy":"format","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/gazette-formats?post=167258"},{"taxonomy":"series","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/news.harvard.edu\/gazette\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/series?post=167258"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}